Jim wrote that he had a “tendency to come over the top or spin out with the left hip entering the impact zone.” I wanted to share my answer to him with everyone, because my suggestions are all part of the Peak Performance Golf Swing.
Jim,
Let’s first address your “tendency to come over the top or spin out with the left hip.” Normally this happens for one (or more) of 3 reasons. Remember, the PPGS is a “limited turn, 3/4 length, vertical backswing. We’ll get to “pulling down” tomorrow.
The first reason that you might be swinging the club to parallel to the ground, or longer, at the top of the backswing. I’ll tie that in below.
The second reason is you may be turning your shoulders too much, likely to at least 90 degrees or more, in the backswing.
Third, you might be “laid off” in your backswing.
Turning your shoulders too much causes the left arm and club to get behind the body in what I call the “Sacred Burial Ground” (SBG) which is everything behind the toe line in both the backswing and forward swing. The key point here is that I have a Surgism that states, “You can stand in the Sacred Burial Ground,” but if you swing in it with your arms and clubs, “You’re DEAD!”
The swing issue here is that when the arms and club get behind the body, and you want to hit a straight shot, which means the club must get back to the ball approaching on the aiming line to square the clubface at impact. That cannot happen in a straight line because the body is in the way and the club would be swung straight down out to the right. So the brain figures out the club needs to be pulled back around and in front of the body to swing it in a straight line toward the target, which would be like swinging toward center field.
Next, the PPGS shoulder turn is ended when the left arm is over the toe line when the club reaches parallel to the ground (9:00 o’clock) in the takeaway. Imagine there is a tree behind your toe line, and once the left arm is over the toe line, the swing is all lift of both arm and the club straight up the tree to a 3/4 length backswing. The key is that the club is lifted vertical, or straight up, pointing to 12:00 o’clock, directly above the hands. I call this the light position, as the club is straight up versus being laid off, or leaning backwards toward 10:00 o’clock, which feels a lot heavier. (Note: you can swing a light club easier, faster and with more control than a heavy club because it is in harmony with gravity.)
In all three swing issues here, when the club is at or past parallel at the top of the backswing, deep or behind the torso in the SBG, or heavy, the torso is used to help the arms and hands pull the club up from past parallel, or from behind the body, and from the laid off or heavy position. Anytime the body is used to help the arms and club pull up and or around, the shoulders and hips are pulled or turn to the left, which in the chain of motion, pulls the club up and out in front of the torso toward the aiming line. And you have the outside-in downswing.
The simple solution is to keep the arms and club in front of the body in a shorter and more vertical 3/4 length backswing where the turn ends and lift begins when the left arm is over the toe line.
The Surge!
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I try to do your swing not to much back swing but I get no power I hit it on a drive 150 yards I am just useing my arms it seams like.My buddy said to me you have to put your back to the target.I need help
During my last round I couldn’t do anything right. Most of my shots were either weak or pull hooks. On the 16th I remembered the hip bump. I have been reluctant to try it because of a bad back. When I tried it I hit three greens in regulation, had three birdie putts (which I missed) and hit the ball dead straight. I can’t wait for my next round tomorrow to see if I still have the swing. Thanks, Bill
Surge,
I agree with, understand fully, and excitingly apply all that you say about the takeaway. No complaints or questions from me about your teaching.
BUT! One very important question I would appreciate you answering and clarifying! How are some great golfers able to play great golf, using a large muscle, 90 degree shoulder turn takeaway, that is totally contradictory to your excellent takeaway theory?
Thanks
hi surge do you have a video of your set up and swing that i can see online i am intrigued as you describe the backswing ,limited turn then upright this sounds the thing i need as i have a short backswing due to shoulder damage as a child,i look forward to seeing the swing,willie
David Condino,
You have it when you say you are just using your arms. The PPGS is more about swing your arms and less body. With less turn and the body moving less, you can swing your arms faster. It is like swinging a rock on the end of a string using centrifugal force. The faster the rock goes the less the hand moves. In swinging a golf club the rock is the clubhead and the hand is your body. Move the body less to swing the arms and club faster. Turning your back to the target is the belief that a big turn is where power comes from. The problem with the big turn is it causes golfers to loose balance as they can’t turn that far without pulling themselves off the ball, changes their spine angle and breaks down the left arm and a whole lot more. I have some articles in the next few days that elaborate on these problems in more detail.
call this the light position, as the club is straight up versus being laid off, or leaning backwards toward 10:00 o’clock, which feels a lot heavier. (Note: you can swing a light club easier, faster and with more control than a heavy club because it is in harmony with gravity.)
Surge….Don’t you mean 2:00 o’clock. At 10:00
o’clock the club would be forward outside of my left foot. Invisioned as if I were looking at a clock straight on.
Don I have trouble stopping with a 3/4 turn.Isemm to go 90 degrees all the time. Help
Surge,
When should the weigt start to transfer in the swing?
Surge; I am 77 yrs old and can’t seem to swing any faster than 85 on my “Speed Stik”. Any ideas on how I can get more clubhead speed? Bud
Surge
Thank you for explanation of over the top. It has been a huge help making sure I don’t turn my left shoulder to far past left foot. I’m hitting straighter and MORE consistently!
Hello Don
I have been hitting my irons long and straight but when it comes to my driver and fairway woods, I hit every thing to my right. As soon as I take the club behind my shoulder I tend to hit stright or on my left. Any comment?
Hassan
What is your opinion of the “Feel” release grips, I thought they might help me square or sligthly close the club face better and get a more full release. I keep hitting the ball with an open club face and am tired of my trips into the woods courtesy of my slice?
hi i am 58 years old and have had a handicap of 12 i am also left handed and reasently have lost all distance on all shots i had a medical condition last year a mini stroke it did not affect and feelings in the golf swing but i have lost a lot of distance hope you can help regards jimmy
Is Coming over the top the same as topping the ball? I have a real bad problem of doing that. Is it due to the fact that im not bending over at the hips. thanks don
I’ve just read your 3/4 back swing to lift the arms from the 9 oclock position straight up vertical. Q, On the down swing Transition do you have advice on the Left arm feel or is it just to swing both arms naturally towards the ball freely….??. Thanks Clive
Surge,
First, thanks for your excellent instruction and insight. I have struggled with coming over the top (OTT)for years but the PP swing has cured me – for the reasons you stated above; the 3 key reasons for OTT are absent in the PP swing. I hit 35 PW’s yesterday and when I went out to pick them up they were in a MUCH tighter grouping than before I started the program. My enthusiasm and enjoyment of the game has never been higher. Thanks.
Gary
It seems your system is opposite of the prevailing wisdom, which states, take the club away with arms and hands then turn it to the top with shoulders. What if one used the conventional wisdom, stopped at 3/4, then went straight up from the 9 o’clock position? In other words c an you combine swing thoughts?
Good afternoon,
I have read the above article and for the most part everything sounds logical but I tried making sure I do not let my arms go back past the toe line but whatever I do I still leave a divot outside to inside when I strike the ball. I can stand there and practice and swing inside to out 100 times in a row but the moment I swing at the ball, no matter how hard I try the divot is outside to in. I don’t mind paying any price if it helps me but until someone can show me a way to strike the ball inside to out I will be very skeptical. This has been driving me nuts for years.
Thank you very much,
Rex
Hi Don, I bought the digital video lessons and have tried incorporating your 3/4 swing. It works great with the mid to short irons but with the longer clubs I just can’t seem to make a short swing with them. It really messes up my timing when I try. Also I am more of a visual learner, can you put DJ’s or your swing on the member site? Down the line front and back, face on and from the back and also from overhead. Regular speed and slow motion. I think that would be a great help to me. I could keep the image of the swings in my minds eye while practicing. One last thing, I have suffered with back problems for years and arthritis in my left shoulder and neck (ski accident). After every round of golf I would tighten up and be in substantial pain. Sometimes I come straight home and have to lay down or take a hot bath. I played five rounds last week using your swing or my early learned variation of it with no pain whatsoever. I will continue to try my best to get the 3/4 swing down, if it allows me to play without pain. I could not believe how good I felt at the end of the week.
I was doing ok following the PPGS instructions to the letter, but my distance gained was not very much -about 10 to 15 yards. I tried a very slight bump to the left before initiating the back swing, reached the highest tree at 12 o’clock easily, and the transition to the up swing to a T just followed very smoothly. I hit my 6 iron now to 175-180 compared to 150-155 before PPGS.
Received your packages and am having some success. I find that, at the beginning of a round, there is a bit of a fade with driver and longer hybrid. This straightens out as I begin to fall into your vertical swing, and particularly when I concentrate on swinging up, not down. I think the slight slice problem stems from old habits – paticularly allowing wrist to break slghtly at top of backswing. Once I focus on shorter backswing, no wrist action and swinging up, fade seems to disappear. I think I may have a slight distance gain. Shot my age (82)twice in last two weeks. Seems to me your swing pattern is similar to that of Colin Montgomery. I believe I also helped myself by having driver cut down to 44 inches. I’m not using lead tape, and I thing lightening swing weight allows a shade more swing speed. Are these reasonable thoughts?
Don, Does your swing lessons come in a left hand version. Is the May21 deadline your time or mine.
PPGS Does not at this moment have a Left Handed version.
Don,
I completely agree with Mario, I also have the digital version, and am struggling with the toe up position if i bring the club level with my toe line parallel to the ground, toe up, and then try to swing up, the momentum of my swing seems to go into the sacred buriel ground, but if i try and start so the club is parllel toe up closer to the ball line its easier notto go behind. It would help to see you or DJ’s swing from all the angles etc.
Thanks
Dave
To Rex Casner,
Okay Rex, you gots to let the wife let you purchase the PPGS DVDs. Then make sure you allow her to buy those shoes she wants so much! LoL!
Until you perform this simple and painless retail task, you will continue to run the clubface across the ball on every strike down! Here is why……
Trahan’s system is NOT about hitting the ball from the inside out. It’s about striking the ball along a straight and vertical path. Rex, the path you take on the backswing is too much to the inside. The equal and opposite reaction to this event is to swing the club on the downswing from the outside in — every time!
The surge’s DVDs will instantaneously teach you how to stop cutting across the ball and instantaneously will get you to hit straighter shots than ever before! Guaranteed!
Namaste!
Surge,
I too would like to see a series of DJ’s swing, I fell like I am almost there (having thinned the ball continually on the range. I was wondering about ball position. ONe last thing I am right handed and left eye domanent. When you look at the ball is there a specific areas that you look at
regards
Hank
To Ed,
Guess what? I’ve the same dilemma! As a result of PPGS, I can now hit my own six iron 220 yards! But alas, I’m not satisfied with the distance. I should be hitting that particular club farther!
Yours is a nice story Ed. Very humorous!
To Dave Singer,
Careful Dave, your backswing take away solution might fail you in the wrong place at the wrong time. It’s better if the clubface draws back to straight up on the toe line. Your idea could at times accidently see the club face breaking the toe line plane.
Try this. Pass the clubface down the toe line as Don instructs, but then consciously bring the uncocked wrists straight up using only your right hand. You will find relying upon the right hand for this move will protect your hands and the clubface from drifting into the “burial ground.”
It is the right hand that will
I viewed the 10 lessons amd have ordered the full version and can’t wait to get started but says site does not recognize the email that i placed my order(email above?) sure hope you can help me!!
Don, I must have missed the lesson on ball placement. Could you please shed some light on this important issue. Thanks RC
SURGE, MY BIGGEST PROBLEM OF GOING VERTICAL IS THAT I FEEL A LOST OF CONTROL OF THE CLUB COMING DOWN, AND I TEND TO EITHER HIT BEHIND THE BALL OR I TOP IT.
MY TWO MAIN PROBLEMS IN THE PAST HAVE BEEN SWAYING AND MY HEAD NOT STAYING BACK…. DAVID
I have been working with the swing and the material for a few weeks now. Mixed results. One thing that has been on my mind is the swing path. In the normally acceptted golf swing there is a “C” Plane that seems to make sense to me for setting each club on the correct path to return the club to the ball. With the vertical swing you tak the club back to your toe line and straight up. It is hard to visualize how you get that back on line as a swing plane. I thought it even seemed harder to imgine as the club got longer and your standing further away from the ball. Which means your vertical plane (in-line with your toes) is much further from the ball. I am a high handi-capper but an avid reader of golf literature, so everything I ever read about the swing has shown how the plane can be drawn to make sense about how the club head gets back square to the ball, I just can't picture it in my head with your swing. Can you explain this for me? It really messed with my head for awhile especially with the driver. Also I seem to be developing a tendency to stand up a bit as I am bringing my arms straight up under my chin causing me to Top a lot of shots. Any suggestions to combat this?
Thanks
I have been working with the swing and the material for a few weeks now. Mixed results. One thing that has been on my mind is the swing path. In the normally acceptted golf swing there is a “C” Plane that seems to make sense to me for setting each club on the correct path to return the club to the ball. With the vertical swing you tak the club back to your toe line and straight up. It is hard to visualize how you get that back on line as a swing plane. I thought it even seemed harder to imgine as the club got longer and your standing further away from the ball. Which means your vertical plane (in-line with your toes) is much further from the ball. I am a high handi-capper but an avid reader of golf literature, so everything I ever read about the swing has shown how the plane can be drawn to make sense about how the club head gets back square to the ball, I just can’t picture it in my head with your swing. Can you explain this for me? It really messed with my head for awhile especially with the driver. Also I seem to be developing a tendency to stand up a bit as I am bringing my arms straight up under my chin causing me to Top a lot of shots. Any suggestions to combat this?rnThanks