Friday, July 30, 2010

Top of Backswing…Back Arm = Right Angle

- Audio version at the end of this post –

I see a lot of questions and comments in the blogs about turning the shoulders too much in the backswing and getting deep behind the toe line and over swinging.  I also see many comments about hitting both chunks and thin shots.  These problems can be cured by simply making sure your back arm (right for right handers and left for lefties) is in a right angle at the top of your backswing.

Let’s start by looking at the concept of tucking the back elbow and keeping it in close to the torso or hip.  The thought is that this provides some connection to the torso and more control of your arm motion.  There is some truth to it, but it causes more problems than it is worth and in fact it is worthless because it is not correct.

For starters, a tucked back elbow is bent at the elbow so much that it looks like a V.  A tucked back elbow is in close to the torso and thus causes a narrow width backswing.  So narrow that it causes the forward arm to bend at the elbow.  This is a major problem because the forward arm must remain relatively straight in the backswing as this is the arm that creates the width of arc.  The forward arm must remain straight because it, along with the club, is the string in the concept of a rock swinging on a string creating centrifugal force.  The wider the arc (remember, the arms swing the rock) the faster the clubhead, and a faster club hits the ball farther.

Another big problem of the back arm folding to a V is that it is being pulled inward toward the torso which is opposite of remaining wide and extended.  A golfer can actually pull their upper arm inward and tight to their side so much in keeping the arm and elbow tucked that they can actually push themselves into a reverse pivot or weight shift.  This pushes their head and spine forward ahead of the ball instead of turning and loading over and onto their rear leg behind the ball.  It can also cause too much torso turn, getting the arms behind the toe line in the Sacred Burial Ground (SBG).  And, to complete the problems, the wrists can break down and cause an over swing to parallel or longer.   This adds more forward tilt to the head and spine increasing the reverse weight shift and lays the club off into the heavy position.

The cure for all these problems caused by intentionally tucking the back elbow, or intentionally cocking the wrists and/or swinging to parallel and not being able to keep the forward arm relatively straight, is simple.  The back arm MUST “Never and I mean never, ever,” BEND, BREAK, or FOLD, past 90 degrees, a right angle.

We all know from science class that a 90 degree right angle is the strongest angle.  In keeping the body functioning in harmony with the laws of physics the arm in a right angle is at its strongest position.  Just look at arm wrestlers.  The first one to start losing their flat wrist and their right angle at the elbow as it starts bending toward a V…looses.

Practice and learn the feeling of your back arm lifting up to form a right 90 degree angle at the top of your backswing.  Keeping your wrist firm helps create the right angle.  That also helps keep your backswing 3/4 and the club more vertical.  Keeping the back arm in a 90 degree angle also helps control the shoulder and hip turn to the forward arm over the toe line for the perfect limited turn PPGS backswing.

The final checkpoint when the back arm is in a right angle with a vertical 12:00 o’clock club will be that both arms form a perfect Equilateral Triangle.  A line drawn touching both elbows as the base of the triangle will be parallel to the ground.  The final important point about this equilateral triangle with the elbows parallel to the ground at the top of the backswing is that the arms, head, neck, shoulders, and back are all in dynamic balance.  And they are strong and free from stress and strain.

I think it is safe to say that a back arm in a 90 degree, right angle at the top of the backswing is simple to do and easy to feel, monitor and check.  Back arm in a right angle at the top of the backswing is simply the “right” thing to do.

The Surge!

- Use these controls for the audio version of this post –

Get Flash to see this player.

Post to Twitter Tweet This Post

.

Please Leave Me Your Comments & Questions!

Tell me what you're thinking... and what part of the golf swing, or this great game... you'd like to know more about. If you want your pic to show with your comment, go get a gravatar!

IMPORTANT: the purpose of this comment section is to foster constructive conversation about improving our blog reader's golf game. This area is NOT designed to answer customer support questions. If you have questions about a purchase or gaining access to our private members area, please contact our customer support team at 800-603-2706 (8:00AM to 6:00PM MST, Monday Through Friday) or click here for email support. We have a new team handling support and they are very good! Please also read the FAQs below as your first course of action.

"The Surge"

Top "Frequently Asked Questions":

Question: I haven't received the product(s) I ordered.

Answer: If you ordered the PPGS Foundations Video Series, or any combination of lesson videos, it's important to understand that these are delivered in a "digital format" in our secure members only area, click here to login and access this valuble content immediately. If you have never logged in before, simply click on the "First Time User?" link at the bottom of the login page and follow the instructions.

The main advantages to this delivery method are; (a) you have access to the content immediately after ordering, (b) you have several different formats that you can view the videos in (including downloadable formats you can burn to DVD and/or put right on your iPhone, or other smart phone, to take them to the practice range and (c) you will get new versions of any products that we revise and/or improve for free without having to wait for updates to be delivered to you through the postal mail.

IMPORTANT: if you want actual hard copy DVDs sent to your home, you can call our customer support team at 800-603-2706 (8:00AM to 6:00PM MDT, Monday Through Friday) and they can get those shipped right out to you for the price of shipping and handling.


Question: I received 1 or more of the 10 free videos, but I'm missing 1 or more. How do I get the free videos that I'm missing?

Answer: You can simply follow this link, put in the email address that you originally signed up with... and you'll be able to view them immediately: http://members.peakperformancegolfswing.com/LostFreeVideos.aspx


Question: I emailed customer service and I never got a response back. How do I get support?

Answer: Unfortantely, email is not a perfect system. If our support team has received your email, they have responded to it... their reply just might not have made it all the way to your email "inbox". If you still need assistance on ANYTHING, please call our customer support team at 800-603-2706 (8:00AM to 6:00PM MDT, Monday Through Friday) and they will take care of you.


  • max
    Your candid advice has helped my game immensly, now I am processing the STACK & TILT method and it seems that what you teach and S&T my game is REALLY improveing. MY question now is "what is your opinion of S&T?
    Max
  • I had a dream to begin my own organization, nevertheless I did not have got enough of money to do that. Thank goodness my friend said to use the mortgage loans. Thence I took the student loan and made real my desire.
  • Tucking in the right elbow to the body in the downswing has about 3 purposes: 1. For power because you can summate the forces of your arm swing with the lower body which moves slightly from inside to outside. This is what the hackers don't do.2.It allows the transfer of axis from the right between the two hip joints to the left hip joint, oltherwise the club will hit the ground first before the balll except when its teed up.3. It has a better chance of creating a draw which increases the distance because of the roll.
    Jack Grout was partly right in thinking that the head or base of the neck is the axis of the swing.But, why does Jack Nicklaus place the ball close to the inside left heel line in all shots? The simple reason is that there are lower axes of the swing that moves the upper axis forward--the hip joints.At the time of impact the left hip joint(downswing axis) is vertically alined about the inside left heel line, therefore also the bottom of the swing. The stop action films of the swing shows a crescent shape with the backswing arc behind the downswing arc.
  • bruce
    to:j.griffen,if you read the post you will see where i said swing the club with your hands and fingers and everything else will follow. that includes the arms, of course the arms will follow, you can't swing without your arms moving. as far as taking the hands and arms out of the swing is totaly the opposite of what jones is trying to say. that drill is just to get the feel of the clubhead swinging. how do you get that feel, through your hands and fingers. read the book again and again. i've read it over 10 times and every time i read it i get something new out of it. the trick is you have to o in reading it with a clear mind not one that is looking to piece a swing together. because a swing is one motion just ONE MOTION.
  • J.G; Thank you for answering my Help question. You know what, I think I am going to do is put down my clubs and gather up some flat round rocks. I have a pond across the street from my house. I going to "actually" perform this drill. Just like I used to when I was a little guy.

    Again.............thanks!! .................Shayne
  • Shayne,

    Have you ever skipped rocks across a pond? Most of us have. Do that motion slowly. What you should find is that as you are taking the hand back to the throwing position just as you are nearing the completion of pulling the arm back, your hip is already starting to move in the direction that you are going to throw the rock. This is the same principal.
  • Giles
    Thanks for answering my query... I think this is going to be a massive help. I also think it is something that should be emphasized more generally as if you look around at other instruction techniques no one is making this point.

    J. Griffin says: From the left shoulder all the way to the club head should be a straight line.
  • Bob Wessel
    I try to take the club up and keep the right elbow pointed down. Unfortunately, when playing, I have a tendency to FLY the right elbow resulting in many problems.

    Do you have a suggestion that would help eliminate the flying elbow?

    In the 70's, Jug McSpadden told me to make a very flat swing and keep the right arm in tight. It worked back then. Unfortunately, I am too old for that swing.

    Help
  • Surge or JG; I still cannot perform the Bump (quoted below by JG in an earlier article). “The transfer back to the left side starts with the bump which is about a 1″ lateral move towards to target which happens just before you actually reach the top of the back swing.”

    Since I beleive this is the Key to correctly swinging down to impact to the ball, do you have any training or hint as to how to perform it?? I have tried the Door drill and the butt to the wall also. That does not move my hip left for me. Do I push the hip left with both by legs moving left maybe?

    How does one laterally move left while still moving his arms up to the top of his backswing? My body cannot do it as I have been trying for months now. I have watched your videos over and over and read the manual on this too. For me, it is like walking forward while at the same time telling one to walk backwards. When I reach the top and can then move left, but not before, or throws my whole torso and balance completely out of whack and I have no idea where my club is going to land.

    “The transfer back to the left side starts with the bump which is about a 1″ lateral move towards to target which happens just before you actually reach the top of the back swing.”

    Help…………….Shayne
  • Mark Plunkett
    Donna,
    Mr Griffins advice is absolutely spot on & this same advice has has itotally improved my swing. By taking the shoulders out of initiating & powering the golf swing & focusing on just straightening my trail back arm in the down/upswing i have got pure square & longer shots happenning again with what appears very little body/shoulder action just a weight transition from the bump.turning up into the T-finish.
    I discovered that this happens naturally & without effort if you just practise (with feet reasonably close) holding your trail open hand/arm in the 90deg 'take an oath' top of backsing position (with this one arm/hand) then straightening it down & thru impact critically keeping your palm perpendicular (square) to the ground at all times.
    I practise this even when just standing around (friends think i'm nuts) & when i'm playing this straightening of my trail arm becomes the key for my bump to happen naturally (really without any thought) & my swing is now so consistantly pure,square & longer because of this contact without the shoulders/body trying to swing the club faster...they can't. ..only the arms (the string) can do that.
    So dont make the shoulders/body part of the string in the analogy as they are actually the stationary (but turning) hand part of the image.
    Hope this helps & i am correct in what i say.
  • Thomas L.
    I've been practicing the 3/4 backswing and found that when the club is lightest (in weight) is when I start my downswing. It has worked pretty well for me.
  • Bob Kelley
    Having great difficulty finding a solution to my driver problems. I'm not only slicing the ball to the right I'm losing distance. I've tried a strong grip but that has caused some pulls to the left. Its very frustrating to see my mid-handicap keep going up.
  • chris russell
    Many thanks for the instruction on ball positioning! I have gone from average rounds to mid 70`s in 1 week!! I am now enjoying my golf again.
    Once again many thanks
  • Bruce?,
    When you have time, please explain how you can swing the club with the hands and fingers and not the arms. I've read Mr. Jones book and really liked it. The whole point of his book was to swing the club head and not create extra angles and moves by movement in the wrists as was common in his day. If you can swing the club with the hands and fingers without arms, I'll be impressed. The hands and fingers hold the club. Granted, Mr. Jones explanation is a bit ambigous with some wording, but the point is that it should be understood that he wanted to take hand movement out of the swing as exemplified in the knife drill. You can't do that drill with just the hands and fingers. You have to swing the arms and the hands have to stay very passive a quiet or it cause tension to be lost in the handkerchief or string.
  • Giles,
    From the left shoulder all the way to the club head should be a straight line. The position you have described creates an angle and it therefore causes you to have to have an extra move to get the club, hands, and arm in line. This usually done by "flipping" the hands to the inside as you start the turn and that is a bad thing.
  • Hey Ron,
    The movement is the beginning. No one ever said the hips stay there. But the bump is a very same movement to initiate the down swing and the transfer of weight. The bump is not the turn or the transfer it's just the first movement. Move much more than that and you have sway. Hopefully you will now have an understanding of this crazy move.
  • Jim Wile
    To Ron,

    Okay, maybe it's not one inch. Maybe it's two inches. The point is, it's not a big lateral move. That can lead to getting "stuck" and big blocks to the right (for righties), as the upper body can't keep up with the lower body.

    Also, if you start pre-loaded heavy right, as Don teaches, a one (or two) inch lateral bump will definitely initiate a weight transfer from right to left.
  • Ron
    Once and for all, no one can move laterally just one inch. One inch is too little of a measurement considering the speed of the swing for anyone to be able to control this minute distance additionally, moving your hips one inch is not going to transfer your weight to your left side and you are not going to properly hit the ball.

    I think is so funny when I see people referring to moving ONE INCH!

    CRAZY,CRAZY,CRAZY!!!!!!
  • bruce
    the right angle with the back arm is ok as long as you don't have to think about while you are swinging. the swinging of the club is done with the hands and fingers after that, the rest of the body will follow. it is , after all, scientific that the mind cannot think of more than one thing at a time,so how, if you are thinking about your 90 degree angle with the elbow will you be able to perforn a true swinging motion. just read Ernest Jones book SWING THE CLUBHEAD and you'll see what i mean. Don is correct about the rock on a string, that is a true swinging motion.
  • Juan
    Great Instruction
  • Giles
    Is is correct that the club should extend in alignment with the left arm? That is to say that the left arm and the club form a straight line down to the ball? Previously my arms have formed a triangle and the club then extended down from the center of this triangle, but on inspecting the ball alignment photos on your post from March 10th I noted that the left arm and club are in alignment and tried this on the range with all clubs - the result was sweet contact and straighter flight... it felt good, but I just want to be sure that it is the right way to go as no one has ever emphasized that to me. And in some places instruction seems to contradict this. Many thanks.

    And let me also say thanks for all the great instruction... really starting to find a consistent rhythm
  • Craig A Stott,

    Please explain your questiona bit better. You want to know about the release of the club from start to finish. The release is what happens during the down swing near impact. It's a term used to describe the action of the hands by many but in the PPGS it is actually the rotation of the right forearm squaring the club face up as it comes into the impact area. If you don't release or hold on, the face is open. If you release too early, the face is closed. So, now, release has to factor in timing and ball position.
  • JIM WINDSOR
    I'M A LEFTY---AND I WOULD HAVE TO SEE IT -TO FOLLOW WHAT YOU ARE SAYING ON THIS BACKSWING---JW
  • Donna,
    I would imagine that if you are constantly battling the come over the top move you have not mastered initiating the down swing with the BUMP. As you approach the top of the back swing the left hip makes about a 1" lateral move towards target that sets the upper body in the correct position for the propler motion of letting the club "free fall" down as you rotate back through impact in the ON-ON-ON position. I'd allmost be willing to bet that if you could see a video of yourself in slow motion that your first move at the top of your back swing is a rotation of your shoulders whick is out and around and causes the outside to in swing.
  • Bob Van Meter
    A picture is worth a thousand words....I can't figure out how a line drawn from one elbow to the other will be parallel to the ground. Please explain.
  • Ronnie McCurry
    Eddie Pearson says:
    March 15, 2010 at 5:59 pm
    I have a serious problem on my backswing by bringing the club back too far. I can most of the time see my clubhead or feel it touch my neck. On practice swing I am fine, until I line up and set to hit the ball. What can I do to stop this madness. Thanx, Eddie


    I would guess you are bending the left arm if you are a righty, going past 90* with the right arm and breaking or cocking the wrist way to much. Sure to hurt your back. Surge teaches verticle.
  • Roy Reed
    For: Bud Holbrook; re Ball position: Bud; go to the very top of this blog, to the right of Don and DJ's picture, and you will see a search box with a green "go" key by it. Type in the words "ball position" and press the "go" button. Everything written about ball position will show up. Scroll down to Post #6 dated 10 March and open it. Then scroll down about 1/2 way and you will find a response from Roy Reed at 1:27 a.m. on 11 March that specifically covers the question you are asking. Hope that helps. Hit em straight. R2
  • H.C. Coughlin
    Totally agree about the 90 degree elbow. However, you are wrong about your arm wrestling techniques. That's OK you're a good golf instructor. Also, as a former coach (not golf) you overly describe incorrect swing flaws. As you know there should no negative thoughts during an activity, we don't need incorrect images described in detail.
  • Guy
    John I apologize.... You were absolutely correct.. It is the two plane swing that is similar to the PPGS.. Sorry about that.. I confused the two.. Guess that is why it didnt work for me.. LOL But yes they are similar as you said with the TWO Plane. sorry you turn your hips instead of the shoulders... Boy did I mess that one up.. :)
  • Guy
    John Retzer,

    I think you were referring to the ONE PLANE being like the PPGS. The reason I say this is I read the books on both and watched the DVDs for Jim Hardy's training. The TWO plane rotates the shoulders to 90 degrees and you must be very flexible to accomplish this. As well you are MORE bent over at address on the TWO plane swing. With the ONE plane you are more upright and you rotate at the hips to the left or right depending on what hand you are in the backswing And this swing is for the less flexible.. Hope that clears up somethings.. But the biggest difference I have seen between the two is that with the PPGS your lower body is quiet in the back swing. With ONE plane your hips are turning towards over your back foot. And then over your front foot in the downswing. Believe me. Having tried this My swing is messed up because I now lead with my hips and pull out of the swing quite often, especially on my drives. Hope I helped a little..

    Guy
  • Guy
    Surge,

    For some of us this cant be helped. For the larger (big bellied guy) the front arm is going to bend some cause its hard to bring it up across the chest straight. I can get my left arm (im LH) into a 90 degree angle, but the right arm still bends in front of my chest on the backswing.. Also with disconnecting the arm from the torso wont that cause a kind of chicken wing effect with the back arm?? Just curious. I have posted a few questions asking about the PPGS for robust men, but have not gotten any answers..

    Guy
  • frank
    hi don and dj
    i think the discs are great,but have always had the problem of the hips going to quick,
    i would have loved seeing more of the lower part in action and in slow mode,also would have been great to see either one of yous hitting 1 wood or a hybrid,i think everybody agrees to seeing that,it seems you are only hitting a seven iron and think thats a much easier club to use,but ime getting there sloly but could do with more detail and pics,it seems like a few people are e-mailing this site and they dont seem to get a reply,just hoping i do
    thanks again guys frank from new zealand
  • Thanks Surge, if you would just show a short video of what you're trying to explain, it will save you a lot of writing.
  • Ken Tucker
    Don do you have any schools for aspiring juniors?
  • I'm just getting through watching the videos and the thought occurred to me .... in what substantial ways is the Trahan method different from the Two Plane Swing mentioned by Jim Hardy in the Plane Truth. It seems that the Hardy Two Plane and Trahan Swings have a lot in common. ...perhaps a blog post is in the offing ...
  • Reid
    Hi Don,

    I have been applying and enjoying you emails and working on game. However, I have only gotten the first seven tips and it seems you have discontinued the last three emails. I haven't got any swing tips or numbered emails in the past month. I'd greatly appreciate it if you sent me these last 3 emails so I could truly experience this great teaching method of yours.

    Thanks,


    Reid
  • George McQueen
    With weather being so lously, trying to visualize using a wedge indoors has been it until today. I hit the wedges, 7 and 5 great with the 3/4 turn. I took my 5 wood and driver along. The 5 wood went higher with a good draw pattern, but the Driver gave me low hooks. Perhaps this will improve but I suspect I may need to have a fitting....something I have never done. I found the best shots with the irons occurred when I just touched my chin with the portion of my upper arm just below the shoulder. A friend told me the club was in the "light" position when this happened.

    Must say I enjoyed the Driver video.......you and DJ did a great job in explaining. Now my job is to apply it to my driver.
  • Richard Bence
    Would like to purchase DVD to watch on my big screen TV. Is that possible?

    Rich Bence
  • Terry Newton
    I tried your grip and 3/4 backswing the other day and had problems hitting the ball then I read the lesson about your stance. I went to the practice range and closed my stance to shoulder width with a 3/4 swing and hit the ball straighter and longer than I have hit in years.
  • Dan Battles
    I'm in rainy, cool Albany, NY. I've only been able to use your swing indoors so far. Today, after not swinging over the weekend, I started pretty rustily, but was hitting it well again after a little while. Here's what I'm thinking. This is still new. I'm wondering what it will be like when I start playing some early Sat. morning matches with the usual crowd. Often there is little, if any, time to warm up and practice before we do 'battle'. Any suggestions for the best ways to warm up and be ready with this new swing? Any optimal quick drills of any kind? You know how people resort to the old and familiar when one loses confidence. I want to give the ppgs every chance, but today at the range gave me a ;chilling' reminder of what it can be like with a new swing.
blog comments powered by Disqus
10 FREE VIDEO LESSONS
Need Help? Have Questions? Click Here For Live Chat Help!
Don’s Putting Video System:
Recent Comments
Don’s Driver Video Series
Recent Posts
Don’s Inner Circle Membership